7X10 MINI-LATHE FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS **** THE DUST IS SETTLING BUT STILL UNDER CONSTRUCTION **** ** Copyright 2000. All rights reserved ** ** No part or parts of this document may be used in any ** way for profit. Individual contributors retain their ** rights to any Copyright laws. ** Thank you to all who participated in egroups and on ** rec.crafts.metalworking DISCLAIMER: You are responsible for ALL of your actions. Where can I find the 7x10 FAQ? http://www.egroups.com/docvault/7x10minilathe/FAQ FORWARD This FAQ is designed as a guide to aid with the purchase and use of the 7x10 mini-lathe. It is not intended to be a full comprehensive metal machine document, an excuse to ignore safe machining technic, nor a 7x10 Users Guide (well ok,... maybe that last one). The FAQ was started after several people had mentioned, and I had been thinking, that it would be nice to have a FAQ for the 7x10. Since the owners manual is,.. lacking (to put it nicely). Here's how the FAQ is laid out: DISCLAIMER Standard gibberish. FORWARD You just read this. WHAT IS AN AFFORDABLE LATHE? An attempt to qualify the type of lathe(s) being discussed HOW DO I GET STARTED (with the 7x10)? Purchasing, tooling, and instruction specific to the 7x10. I'VE RECEIVED MY LATHE, NOW WHAT? Unpacking, alignment, running the 7x10. MAINTENANCE Removing parts, replacement parts, and ordering OEM parts. MODIFICATIONS Making the 7x10 better, stronger, faster (er,.. slower) LINKS To cover questions I missed, or no one has asked. APPENDIX A - GENERAL USENET QUESTIONS Questions every newbie has (such as what's a newbie?). APPENDIX B - GENERAL MACHINING QUESTION Questions relating to machining in general (such as how do I sharpen lathe bits?). QUOTE OF THE DAY I don't think this will change as this one says it all!! ==================================================================== WHAT IS AN AFFORDABLE LATHE? What is an affordable lathe? What lathe can I buy for making pens? What lathe would you recommend for learning on, without spending a lot of money? I'd like to take up machine work, but don't have a lot of room. Is there a lathe you would recommend? Combi 218 - (~450usd, shipped. Includes dead center, No chuck) (Information from their web site) Motor 300W Net Weight 8 kgs Center Height 48 mm Distance Between Center 200 mm Swing Diameter over Tool Carrier 70 mm Cross Slide Travel 50 mm Hole Through Spindles 8 mm Spindle Nose / Hole M14 x 1 / 10 mm Speed Range (high) 680/1360/1880/2400/3400 rpm (low) 170/250/350/440/600 rpm Thread Pitch 0.2~1.75 mm (metric) 12~48 tpi (imperial) System offers imperial threadcutting capability (metric is an option) Power Feed is standard. Price / Performance compared to competitors. raduated Drive Handles. Load Adjustable Bearings. Parts Interchangeable with EMCO / UNIMAT 3 and 4 Milling head (3in1) and woodworking attachments available. Clisby - A micro lathe developed by the original producer of the Sherline lathe (see company history: http://www.clisby.com.au/Company.html). Their 2.5x4.5 lathe is priced at $167usd, $200usd with a 6" bed. The machine is built from aluminum extrusions for light weight. The price includes a 12DCV, 1500RPM motor. The lathe is available in either a metal or wood configuration. Numerous accessories are available from their webb site. Attachments and tools are also available for woodworking. There is no provision for threading. (no weight indicated) Gingery - Take a load of charcoal, bunch of pistons, pile of sand, and a match. Build your own lathe. Muli-purpose lathe/mill/drills - Not the Smithy or Shoptask, which are $$$. You know the one. HF sales flier, $549usd, gee not much more than a 7x10, should I get it instead? Yeah, that's the one. No electronic variable speed. There is a separate 1/2 hp motor for the lathe and mill/drill. Speed selection for both is via a pulley/belt system. No provision for threading. Not movable, 473lbs. I was set to buy one when I saw it in the store. While the threading was my hanging point, I must say the model I saw in the store far from impressive. Sherline - Swing over bed 3.50" (90mm) Swing over carriage 1.75" (45mm) Distance between centers 8.00" (200mm) Hole through spindle 0.405" (10mm) Shipping weight 24 lb. (10.9 kg) $550usd from Sherline direct. A threading kit is available. Taig - This too is an extruded aluminum based lathe. From Nick Carter's webb site, "The lathe as it comes, consists of the steel topped, concrete filled aluminum extrusion bed, the carriage (x axis travel), the crosslide (y axis travel), the ball bearing headstock, toolpost for 1/4" bits, and the depth stop for the carriage. Generally one buys the lathe, tailstock, pulley set, one or several chucks, and motor for a complete lathe." $350 A large selection of accessories is available. There is no provision for threading. One homemade modification to provide threading can be found at: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/leadscrew.html Unimat 4 - 1.81" Center Height 7.87" Between Centers 3.62" Swing over Bed 2.59" Turning diameter between centers 2.04" Cross slide travel .401" Hole through spindle 8 speeds 130-4000 rpm 17lbs weight $395.00usd Includes: toolholder, dead center, motor, service tools, manual Used - There are many lathes available on the used market. Schools eliminating machining programs can be an inexpensive source for mid to full sized lathes. Watching the classifieds revealed several lathes but the prices were upwards of $1000usd. These lathes also required quite a bit of desk space and would not be considered movable. 7x10? - The 7x10 is a cast iron, Asian made, electronic- variable speed, mini- lathe with threading capability. Sold as Harbor Freight's Central Machinery 7x10, or Grizzly's 7x10. The 7 refers to the swing over the bed (7") and the 10 refers to the distance between centers (10"). As currently advertised (older lathes may differ) the 7x10 has an 1/2 hp motor with electronic variable speed low-186 to 1100; high-440 to 3000RPM with reverse. The 'plastic' change gears allow 18 threads ranging from 12 to 52 TPI. The headstock has a MT3 and the tailstock MT2. Accessories included with the lathe; 3 jaw chuck with internal/external jaws and chuck key. Weighing in at 74lbs the machine is movable, but does not qualify for 'easily movable'. What got me considering the 7x10 is the following article by Jose Rodriguez: http://www.pioneer.net/~felice/hf.html With all that said, the 7x10 (as well as many other Asian produced machines) has been called a 'kit' machine. This refers to the fact that often cleaning, adjustments, and sometimes the parts themselves are not done well at the factory. Cleaning may be as simple as removing the shipping cosmoline (anti-rust grease) to removing casting sand from beneath the paint. Adjustments range from tightening screws or adjusting gibs to requesting replacement parts to correct an out of alignment problem. Modifications have been developed to correct poor design. How does the 7x10 compare to the X minilathe (X=Clisby..Sherline)? Well, I can give you some information now. Unless you are looking for a toy, don't buy one {Clisby}. It was one of those things; you see something and suddenly you are all eaten up with the desire to get one. Then after you get it, you wonder why. I saw it on the Clisby web page and it looked so cute, I just had to have it. It {The Clisby} is not worth the price. It has less quality built into it than does the 7x10. After I got it, It became a challenge to see if I could make something useful with it. I've added a larger motor (same size as the R500(or is it the 550) but with better low speed torque. I bought the controller and ordered a transformer. When I get that done, I will try and build a compound slide. If and when I get something useful, I'll have spent more than I spent on my 7x10 and still won't have anything near the 7x10. It has 1/4X20 lead screws. Neither the slide, cross slide or the tailstock is smooth. All have a binding on one side that makes moving them annoying. When I first moved the cross slide, the gib(jib?) fell out. The jib(gib) was not counter drilled for the set screws. I drilled the countersink myself. The screws are just that; no locking nuts. All and all, it's a toy. But as the man says, sometimes your hormones just get the better of you. Or was that sometimes you get the bear and sometimes it gets you. I was got. (Thanks to: Onis Cogburn) -- I have a Taig lathe,and although I have ben happy with it, I am going to purchase a 7x10. My main to reasons for this is that the Taig can not cut threads, and I need a little larger lathe. The Taig came out of the box and was set up in about 1 hour. The 7x10 needs some tweaking here and there to get it set up correctly. There are lots of accessories for the Taig, but I don't use many of them with the exception of the 4 jaw chuck. I did use some of the others before I got my mini mill though. The Taig is also a little small to do milling on. (Thanks to: Dale)4708 -- I love my Taig, dead accurate and very useful for small work. It'll work about any material you can chuck into it, respecting its small size and horsepower, of course. I use mine for turning Teflon bushings, aluminum stock, and the occasional bit of steel. The milling attachment has a very limited range of motion, but I've used it to good effect on some projects as well. I have bigger equipment, but the little Taig doesn't gather any moss. I still prefer it for small work. (Deja:Gary Coffman) -- I like my Taig, others in my local club like their Sherlines. Good work can be done on either machine. The Taig fit my needs nicely and fits my approach of tweaking things and making improvements. The Taig has t slots all over the place that say "Add something neat here!" In this small size there is basically Taig and Sherline. Both are good machines. Taig is a bit more spartan and tends to encourage users to make and modify tools and fittings, while the Sherline is a nicer looking unit. Taig has no threading capability included or available from Taig, although work this small is likely to be done with dies rather than single pointing. Taig costs less. I have a Taig for really small work, along with a 9x20 and a 13X7ft that is almost restored. If you go with Taig, get a spare set of jaws for the three jaw chuck, having soft jaws that are cheap makes it very easy to customize a jaw shape for a special job, then reface or save the jaws for similar tasks in the future. I'd also recommend getting the collet set if you're into small spindle work. The Sherline has nice smooth surfaces that I'd hesitate to mess up. On the other hand, threading and power feed are possible with manufacturer provided accessories, and the Sherline has a really nice variable speed DC motor. The Taig uses step pulleys. Sherline has much nicer calibrated feedwheels, adjustable zero as an option. The Taigs are not adjustable and are stamped rather than laser etched. The lack of adjustable zero handwheels on the Taig is a pain, but if you've never used a lathe with these you won't notice. I may make new handwheels one of these days, or buy some from Sherline and work up a retrofit. I think if you price out a lathe with tailstock, compound, collets, three and four jaw chucks, and other goodies as desired you will end up with a fair price difference, with Taig less expensive. I don't know what sort of projects you want to get into, if steam engines, you may want to consider a larger lathe, a four inch flywheel looks pretty big on these machines. The Taig looks like a homebrew, the Sherline looks like a nice model. Neither one is suitable for hogging out big cuts in steel. If you need WW collets, you can buy a spare headstock with a WW spindle for a Taig for about 70 bucks. Whatever you end up with, learn to sharpen tools well. Small lathes are very picky about sharp properly formed cutting tools, the close enough cutter on a larger lathe won't get by on a small machine. If you want to go higher in price, there are also Prazi and Sakai, both starting at about $1600. Lovely machines, but you can get a 12" swing when you get into these ranges, or a clean used SB 9 incher well tooled in VG to EX shape. As a last option, there is a Chinese 7x10 that is popular with some folks. Grizzly has it for about $300 on their close out web page. (Deja:Stan Stocker) -- The electronics went south (on the 7X10) after a short run of turning the same diameter insert pins for a small injection mold. I bought a Sherline after that and have had no problems. (Deja post:Jay Catmull) -- I had one and sold it {7x10}. It looks great at first but the gearbox broke the first time a tool chattered. Got a spare gear but what a pain to change it. Also it looks nice, but there is tons of slop in the slides. You can adjust the lash but it doesn't last. Also the lead screws had about 0.030" backlash ! For about the same money get a Sherline. It's a real machine and very well made. (Deja:Paul Stavrou) -- I bought myself a 7x10 from the Grizzly outlet store for $300 [no returns]. I can see why there are no returns, everyone would do it. The thing was so covered with grease, it required a complete disassembly before it could be used at all. The gib system in the crossfeed is so bad it has 1/4 inch of upward freedom when properly adjusted. This causes 1/4" of travel in the chatter when trying to cut steel. This breaks tools. The only tooling was a #2MT dead center. Woopi. This thing is going to require 40 hours of fixing to get any use at all. (Deja: Clark Magnuson) -- Hey they {7x10} may arrive looking like a sow's ear but it doesn't take much to turn these little lathes into a silk purse. There's an active 7x10 community that is very willing to help out new owners with heaps of tips and advice. More than that even -- there's a reamer which has probably passed through two-dozen hands and traveled tens of thousands of miles as it is sent from user to user so that the headstock can be bored out a little. The cross- slide does have too much slop -- but this can be fixed with a tiny shim washer that takes about 15 minutes to make and fit. Likewise the compound can be made silky smooth by spending $5 and 90 minutes or so to replace the standard bushing with a ball bearing (I did this last weekend and documented the process on my website at http://aardvark.co.nz/pjet/lathefix.htm ) In essence, to make these lathes "nice" you need to: 1. pull it apart and clean off the cosmoline (grease) 2. polish the gibs to get rid of the burs and rough bits 3. add the little shim to the cross-slide mechanism 4. add a small plastic or metal shield over the gears behind the "big wheel" that engages the rack and moves the carriage. Those are the basics -- this will give you a nice little lathe. As with all machinery however, you can keep going and add the compound bearing, Buy and fit all manner of chucks, steadies, tail-stock bits-and-pieces, etc. I'm also working on a new electronic speed controller/tach which will allow more flexibility and control over the motor speed. Even if you cost your time at the end of the basic exercise you'll find you've still got a pretty cheap little lathe that is very The best way to think of these machines is that they arrive as a loosely assembled collection of parts. All you need do is clean the pieces up a bit and assemble to build your own lathe. Now, admittedly, they don't tell you this in the sales brochure ;-) (Deja: Bruce Simpson) -- At last, I have got my Grizzly 7X12 lathe by Monday ordered last Thursday, 2.5 working days. I live in Seattle area which is a couple hours South of Grizzly warehouse. The truck man was so kind helped unload it into the home garage, I was away at work. Package weight = machine weight + styrofoam and box. No need to perform wax removal just wipe off the bearing grease on bare metal and I am in business. The first two things I wanted to check was the dead band of the slide and the cross. Slide has 2.5 divisions free run while the cross has up to 8 divisions. My question is, do I need to refine it or it is within practical tolerance? If so please hint. :-> With protection to my hands under gloves, I have verified that Grizzly 7X12 has a real rpm governor, not just any speed controller with inferior torque at low speed. It support set RPM regulation at a VERY wide range of shaft loading. (Thanks to: YK Chan of Seattle 5592) -- I have the Grizzly 7x12 and it is much easier to use for boring and such. Everything else is pretty much the same as the 7x10, which means its still easy to get help and tooling advice from other members of this group. The 7x12 also came with a steady rest (though it was not advertized as being included) and for what its worth, you get a "free gift" for buying expensive things from Grizzly, so I got a set of 16 Forstner bits too. Their customer service is excellent. My chip tray was bent in shipping and they sent me a new one without requiring me to return it. I would spend the extra money the first time and get the 7x12. Just my opinion. (Thanks to: John Alden 5597) -- I just got my lathe and after a through cleaning, I fired her up and I experienced the most sickening noise I have ever heard. On inspection I found that the motor was all out of adjustment and it tried to eat the belt. Although I finally figured out how to get it adjusted, has there been a "fix" discussed for the mickey mouse way the motor is attached, adjusted and aligned? This one was inspected in Jan of 99 and arrived in good shape, other than not being tweaked. (Thanks to: Doug 4706) -- The Grizzly apparently has 4" more bed length than the HF 7x10 despite the 7x12 spec - see pix in the VAULT. It also has a better power supply and may have a more powerful motor. Grizzly's service is usually much better than HF as is the out-of-the-box quality. If you've got the money, you will be happy with the 7x12 but, with shipping, it is $200 more than the 7x10 on sale at $329 and free shipping. There are many days when I wish I had an extra 4" (on the lathe bed, that is) :) (Thanks to: Michael 5586) -- For that GENERAL price range (maybe a tad more than $400), you have the following choices that I'm aware of: HF 7x10 $350 Taig $300 (or so...) Sherline $400 (or so...) Clisby $200 (plus extras) Unimat $300 (USED on ebay) I can only speak from experience with their milling attachment, but the Taig is very well machined. It's just light weight and consists of a lot of aluminum, which we both know is prone to wear. But the Taig is a good value, perhaps the best value in the bunch because their accessories are very reasonably priced. The Taig from what I understand uses a non-standard tailstock, so you can't buy accessories for it outside of what Taig sells. I don't think it's a taper in other words. The Taig is also priced without a motor at all, so you can put whatever you want on it, but expect to pay more than the base price you see advertised. The Sherline is a very nice lathe, but it's also very small from what I've been told. They sell an extended bed version that helps. As with the Taig, it's mostly aluminum. The Sherline uses a MT1 for the headstock and a MT0 for the tailstock (tiny!). You don't have a lot of options in MT1, and even less in MT0. Sherline's accessories are on the expensive side. The Sherline is also light weight like the Taig. Sherline sells a fairly expensive attachment, though, that lets you turn the lathe into a mill. Variable speed make this lathe more attractive. The Clisby is a sort of old/new arrival. I can't tell you much about their operation, but expect some of the same kinds of designs as you'd get with the Sherline. The Clisby is made in Australia if I'm not mistaken, and it's designed by the same guy who designed Sherline's little lathe years ago. Right now there aren't a lot of options for it, but the price is the most reasonable in the lot. Again, you're looking at aluminum as the core alloy. I don't know about the tapers and so forth. I also don't know about the motor. The older Unimat lathes have quite a following. I'd call them a micro lathe. Neat gadget machine with a lot of accessories. Once of the nice things about it, like the Sherline, is you can convert it to a mill. The older machines were cast iron so they were heavier for their size (16" overall size I think, I don't know what the distance between centers is). They are capable of great accuracy on small parts though. I've talked to several folks who have or have had one and if all you want to do is turn tiny things, this is a nice lathe. Unimat still makes lathes, but the new ones are IMHO utter crap, consisting mostly of PLASTIC...YES, PLASTIC. You can call it "space age" or "shuttle craft" plastic, but plastic is plastic. If you want an older Unimat, expect to overpay for it, starting at $200 and going up, on ebay. You don't want a new one. Oh, and attachments are proprietary. The motor is single speed, and there are pulleys to allow you to adjust speed (the old/hard way). The 7x10 is a real lathe. The only real lathe in the bunch IMHO. It has a real headstock, real tailstock, with real tapers that you can find after market parts for. MT3 in the headstock and MT2 tailstock means you have a wide variety of accessories made for other lathes that will fit your lathe. The tapers in fact are really oversized for the size of the lathe, but nobody is complaining! Also, the lathe was originally designed, I think, for a 3/8" tool bit but for whatever reason they cut it back to 5/16". I say this because if you clamp a 5/16" tool bit in the center of the turret, there's blank space on either side of the tool. If you center a 3/8" square tool bit in it, though, it hits the edge of the turret. 5/16" tool bits are a little harder to find, but they're out there. Some folks have ground the bottom of their turret down so they can go ahead and use 3/8" tool bits. You just lose the stops at 90 degree increments. The lathe is also variable speed, and beefy weighing in at 65 pounds unpacked, I think. I love the lathe, only wish it had a few more inches of distance between centers. There's a lot of iron in it, and you get a great support group :) (Thanks to: Mike W 2278) -- HOW DO I GET STARTED (with the 7x10 mini-lathe)? PURCHASING Where can I buy a 7x10 mini-lathe? Harbor Freight - Consistently the 'least expensive' supplier of the 7x10. If it's more than $369usd, wait for a sale. $329usd has been the cheaper of the sale prices ($349 the 'usual' sale price). Several people have indicated that the lathe they received was not of satisfactory condition and were able to return it for an exchange. Grizzly - Grizzly is no longer selling the 7x10. Their outlet store does continue to advertise it at the incredibly low price of $299.95usd + $20usd freight. Per their site, "Please note that all sales through the Grizzly Outlet store are final". Grizzly does sell a 7x12, however. Current price is $515usd including shipping. While not specific covered in this FAQ, the specifications indicate that the 7x12 is similar enough for most of the information to apply. Ebay - Well, like any auction, you takes your chances. You'll also find that prices appear to start around Harbor Freight's sale prices. You might even notice that the auction will appear when a Harbor freight sale starts. Then the bidding takes over. Some bidders, unaware of the sources for this lathe can bid it beyond it's reasonable, delivered price, and then have to pay for delivery. CANADA Busy Bee Tools ENGLAND ELSEWHERE Where can I find the electrical schematic for my 7x10? See links->Personal Sites for 'manual' Where can I find a manual for this used 7x10? See links->Personal Sites for 'manual'. TOOLING What do I buy for the lathe? What tooling do I need? 1320 HSS bits (3/8" or 5/16", see below) 4 jaw chuck 3MT dead center for spindle 2MT dead center for tailstock 2MT drill arbor for tailstock (drill chuck adapter) Drill chuck 3/8" 3MT end mill holder 1/2" 3MT end mill holder End mills (Thanks to: Mike Meagher 1320) What size bits does my lathe take? Your machine may take a 5/16" or 3/8" bit. If you want to have a bit available when your machine arrives, order one of each. Newer machines seem to be taking the 5/16" bit, but as people have found,... don't assume anything with this lathe! How do I determine what sized bit my 7x10 takes? The top of the tool bit (the cutting edge) should be at the center line of the lathe. Easiest thing to do is mount a tool bit (any size) and draw it across the face of round piece of stock with the chuck stationary. This will make a mark across the face. Measure the distance from the center and add/subtract that from the size tool you used. (Thanks to: Lewis Balentine 4834) Do I need to buy a chuck? The 7x10 is shipped with a 3 jaw chuck. You can also purchase a 4 jaw chuck, as well as 3MT end mill holders. How do I add a 4 jaw chuck? There's a couple of ways to add a 4 jaw chuck. Many have purchased a Taig or Sherline 4 jaw chuck and built an adapter plate to 'sit' in the back of the chuck. Others have purchased a 3" 4 jaw from J&L (PCC-19500A ~$70usd) which has 4 holes that match the 4 holes in the spindle. Then 4 metric screws are needed to act like 'studs' in the chuck. An extra nut will be needed as the 3 jaw only has 3. Is there a review of chucks for the 7x10? I have just put up a review on chucks for our 7x10, With lots of images of the TAIG, ABS, and J&L 3" & 4" chucks. Also if you are interested in the Collet Chuck saga, I'm half way through building my 5C Chuck. Come take a look. WARNING on slow links both the chuck review & the projects page are SLOW to load. I am going to have to separate the 5C chuck from the projects page. {See Ty's links under 'person links' below} (Thanks to: Hoeffer, Ty 5656) What grease do I need for the lathe? What lubrication do I need for the lathe? Way oil - I was able to purchase way oil from a machinery distributer for under $15usd, in a 1 gallon sized jug. There is some debate on whether or not to lube the change gears. If you choose to do so, a grease based lubricant is recommended over oil-based. White lithium grease is most often mentioned. Should buy HFs lathe tool kit and indexable carbide tool set? If you're talking about the $79.00 tool set, forget it. That set is made for a much larger lathe and is almost useless for the 7X10. I installed a QC toolpost of the Aloris style on mine and it works great. It was $175.00 from J&L, but I saw the same thing from Enco for $149.00. A small amount of adaptation was necessary; I had to turn and re-thread the mounting stud, and some of the adjustment studs were a bit short, necessitating making new ones. It's sure nice to have that Quick Change functionality! (Thanks to: Jim Dunmyer) INSTRUCTION Are there any Books or Video? Yes, Sherline publishes a mini- lathe book and Jose sells videos of the 7x10 (as well as others). See the links section. Also, Sherline's web site has a page for aligning and running their lathe. Many of the technics can apply to the 7x10. If you're new to metal lathes, get a copy of "How to Run a Lathe" by South Bend Lathe Works, vintage 1942. Reprints are available from Linday Books. It'll tell you how to sharpen tool bits, how to cut threads, etc. (Thanks to: Jim Dunmyer 5570) The Department of the Army has a Fundamentals Of Machine Tools page on their web site. Chapter 7 is Lathes. See links section below. I'VE RECEIVED MY LATHE, NOW WHAT? UNPACKING What do I do if the shipping crate is damaged. Contact the shipper as well as the company you ordered it from. Depending on the damage, you may not have to ship it back, BUT BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY. Call first, open later. What do I do if there's parts missing? Once you have the crate open, verify all the parts are there. If you didn't receive a manual, look for 'manual' in the links below. If parts are missing, then call and ask if they can ship them out. The 7x10 is usually shipped with 1) The lathe 2) The base pan 3) 4 removable rubber feet & bolts 4) 3 jaw chuck with internal jaws 5) External jaws for the chuck 6) Various hex wrenches (not a great loss if missing) 7) Live center 8) tail How do I get the Cosmoline off? Hard - rub it with a rag and use lots of elbow grease. Easier - put solvent (mineral spirits, diesel, kerosine) on the rag (please use gloves & plenty of ventilation,.. NO SMOKING) Breeze - parts washer (then disassemble, dry, lube and reassemble). ALIGNMENT How do I remove leadscrew play? Varmint Al and others have removed the lead screw slop by inserting a shim of the appropriate thickness between the end of the right-hand end of the lead screw and the pillow block. Varmint Al also achieved vertical alignment of the lead screw and the half nuts by converting the right-hand pillow block’s mounting holes into vertical slots with a file. This suggested to me that the lead screw slop could be removed by slightly enlarging the pillow block’s mounting holes in the horizontal direction. This made sense because inserting a shim merely introduces two more surfaces; the original mating surfaces of the lead screw shoulder and pillow block were still there. However, before I started to file the slots in the right hand pillow block, I loosened the left-hand pillow block, pushed it to the right and retightened it. It did move more than enough so that when I remounted the right-hand pillow block all of the lead screw’s slop was gone. The moral of this story is if the slop can’t be removed by moving the right-hand pillow block check the left-hand pillow block before making shims or cutting slots. (Thanks to: Norman 1308) How do I align the tailstock? I think I have an easy way to line up the headstock with the tailstock. All you need is a 1" mike and a piece of 7/8 or 1" dia metal. Chuck round in chuck, turn down to as near as you can to the tailstock ram. Mine is .865" dia. While still chucked bring up tailstock ,lock down and advance ram to just touch the chucked piece. Now in the perfect ( ha ha) world the two diameters will match perfectly. (fat chance). If so you should be able to straddle the two dia.and get the same mike reading as the ram alone. Probable when you bring the two together they will be out of line horizontally or worse yet vertically. If so change the adjustment screws ( I am assuming you have a 2 piece tailstock like my 3 day old little red) to eye ball close and keep changing till the dia. readings are alike for the horizontal adjustment. Vertical you will have to shim up or machine down. (Thanks to: Walt West) How do I remove slop from the 1/2 nuts? Before breaking it all down, I had observed that the half- nut seemed difficult to engage and seemed to be misaligned by being too far toward the backside of the lathe. The carriage, as I call it, is made up of two major pieces, the saddle (part that goes across the ways, HF # 93) and the apron (part that hangs down in front, HF # 70), and is bolted together by two M8x20 socket head bolts. There are milled slots in the saddle for the socket heads which allows adjustment of the final apron position. By leaving these socket head bolts loose and engaging the half- nut, and running the lathe with the leadscrew engaged, the apron self-aligned in the inward/outward plane. Then I tightened the bolts, making sure the apron was somewhat equally aligned front to back. This seems to have resulted in much easier engagement of the half-nut during operation. The final location of the apron bolt heads in the saddle slots was about in the middle, so there is plenty of adjustment room. (Thanks to: Rick K. in Portland, OR) How do I eliminate slop in the cross-slide? What does these three little screws along the cross-slide do? It's worth taking the cross-slide off to see for yourself what these screws do -- but in essence, the two hex-head screws screw into each end of a long threaded block in which the lead screw runs. The center screw simply pushes down on the top of that block so as to put tension on the two other end screws. Think of it as a little see-saw (teeter-totter) with the hex screws being on the ends and the center screw acting as the pivot point and controlling the overall height between the block and the cross-slide itself. I believe that the method for adjusting them is to wind the cross slide towards the handle almost as far as it will go, then adjust the hex-head screws to cant the threaded block such that you get rid of most of the backlash without creating undue friction. {The following was in a reply to Bruce's message and has be left inserted as Bob posted it: This is where we part company. I think that the correct setting is the one that causes the least binding. Backlash in the cross slide was in my machine almost entirely caused by slop where the shoulder on the 10 mm screw is captured between the index block and the main assembly. On my machine it was cured by shortening the index block by about .001 less than the amount of slop. I have no argument with the rest of what is said here. (Thanks to: Bob 5675) End of Bob's comments, back to Bruce...} Then you tighten the center screw to place tension on the two hex-head screws and "lock" things into place. It is rather fiddly because you also have to realize that it's not just the angle of the threaded block but also its height that is important. If the block is too low or too high (ie: both hex-head screws are wound too far in or out) then it will be placing an additional load on the leadscrew. The symptoms of having the wrong height are that the operation of the cross-slide frees up as you wide the slide away from the handle and tightens up as you wind towards it. This is why you should adjust the screws with the cross slide would almost up to the handle -- because the effect is most pronounced at that end and it becomes easier to determine if you've got the height right. Personally I think this is a pretty crude mechanism for adjusting the backlash and building something better is quite high on my list of "must do" modifications. I hope my description is adequate -- but as I say, it's worth pulling the thing apart so you can see for yourself. It will also give you the chance to clean all the crud out from underneath it and relubricate it properly (which can make quite a difference to the smoothness of operation). {The following is Bruce's response to Bob's comments from above} You are correct that most of the slop is caused by the need for a spacer -- but the whole reason for that silly little tilting block is to take up the remainder of the backlash. I know that on my lathe, despite the addition of the shim washer to remove that element of the problem, I can get a few thou of slop if I don't adjust it out using the screws. (Thanks to: Bruce Simpson 5677) -- I think you guys are getting way too worried about a little slop in the feeds in your lathes. I have used lathes quite effectively that had a half turn on the compound. You will always have some slop. Ball screws aren't a good idea because A. They are EXPENSIVE! B. They have very little drag so cutting pressure will usually cause the slide to move without a brake of some kind. They are usually used on a CNC machine where there are stepper motors to hold the lead screw and 0 lash is required. For most purposes you can measure how much back lash is in your lathe and account for it when you move the hand wheels. As long as you always feed the same direction and the dovetails are tight it is irrelevant. That said I do worry about the compound feed. The setup on the compound is a half built piece. The feed dial is being used to take the thrust which results in it being nearly useless for it's intended purpose. The bearing modification looks to be a good idea, but it could still result in the thrust being taken on the feed dial. I have modified mine to add a thrust surface behind the existing boss. I am in process of further modifying it to include a bearing. I may have to make a new lead screw to do it though. In fact I am thinking of scraping the whole compound and cross slide assembly and starting over. (Thanks to: Gary Hallenbeck 5841) RUNNING THE 7x10 How do I turn tapers on the 7x10? The subject of taper turning on the 7X10 has come up several times in this group. The compound travel is not long enough to use for MT3 tapers or longer and it's very difficult to move the carriage and still get the taper accurately. There is an alternative technique that J.W. Early kinda mentioned in passing that I don't think a lot of people picked up on: that is by using a boring head in the tailstock. Most of the 2 inch boring heads will offset 1/2-5/8", plenty for Morris Tapers. I bought a used 2 inch boring head with an R8 shaft and turned the shaft down to MT2. Also fabricated two ball end "dead centers", one for the boring head held in the tailstock and one for the chuck (4-jaw, in my case). Center drill the taper blank on both ends. Using a lathe dog on the chuck end of the blank (the chuck jaws will catch the dog), put the blank into the lathe (between centers) and snug up with the tailstock. Carefully measure the total length of the blank and determine the total amount of taper needed. Just dial in 1/2 the total taper using the boring head dial--usually graduated in 0.001". You can groove the taper at the gage line to the appropriate "large end" diameter or not, as you wish. You can then adjust the compound angle (or tool holder) to your normal angle relative to the taper. Use the carriage and turn your taper as for normal turning. Measure carefully when you get close to the finished size, take a very light cut to finish up. You have just turned a perfect taper. Note: Since it is such a {major inconvenience} to change the chuck, I don't bother to use a face plate. The chuck jaws (installed for "outside holding") catch the lathe dog just fine. In any event, the workpiece should be turned between centers. Thanks, JW for the idea! BTW, HF has a 2 inch boring head with 3 shanks supplied; MT2, MT3,and one other. All for $80.00. Back ordered for 3 weeks, of course! (Thanks to: Toby Billings of Flagstaff and of course J.W Early for the original) How do I rotate the compound rest? The compound does rotate, but you need to run it almost all the way back first. You will then expose two socket head cap screws that are sitting in counterbores. Loosen these screws and the compound will rotate freely. It's not the most user-friendly design, and it may take some trial and error work if the angle you need is critical. Why do some photos show a protractor on the compound rest? HF 7x10 lathes come with a protractor, but I have heard that Grizzly lathes do not. I have a HF model, so I may be mistaken about Grizzly. Someone please correct me if this is in error. (Thanks to: Mike Meagher of Carrollton, TX) The older 7x10 lathes didn't have a compass. One of the 7x10 lathes that a friend of mine bought from Grizzly, which turned out to be an older model, didn't have one. The newer ones do have one, and if you go to Ty's site, you'll find the 7x10's manual. Look for the compass part and order it. I'll bet it's $5. Then just tap a couple holes in the compound and I think it'll work, assuming there's clearance for it. (Thanks to: Mike Welch 4589) How do I get more gearing out of my stock 7x10 change gears? Varmit Al's web site has a gearing program which provides additional pitches with the stock change gears. MAINTENANCE How do I remove the headstock? The answer I found out is yes, both the motor and lead screw can stay on while removing the headstock, this is how I done it. 1 - remove the switch cover 4 screws. 2 - remove the three wires that are screwed to the headstock casting. 3 - remove the wire guard ( black plastic ) just above the leadscrew 2 screws. 4 - remove the two bolts holding the headstock casting on front of lathe. To do this I inserted the allen keys up from the bottom behind the lead screw, which only leaves you the short end to turn. So I took a length of about 12" of 5/8 rod that I had a centered drilled one end, an inch and half, I the slipped this over the allen key end and with one quick jerk they were free. Then I simply unscrewed both of them all the way. 5 - I turned the lathe around 90 degrees so that the tailstock was at the back of the bench, and removed the 2 screws holding the motor cover,( also need to remove back chip guard if it is still on ). 6 - the last bolt holding the casting to the bed is just above the motor in a very tight space, to remove it, I took a cheap pair of imported vice- grips, and ground down the lips on the jaws to make them thin enough to reach into the gap between the motor and the bottom of the bed. Once that was done I gripped the bolt with them and again one good hard fast jerk loosened the bolt. 7 - now you will notice that this bolt can't be removed as the motor is in the way, but if you stand at the end of you lathe and with your right hand lift on the chuck, while your left had take little turns on the bolt, you will soon see that the headstock is rising. Keep doing this until the chuck side of the headstock is up far enough, that you can slip the belt off of the motor pulley, and the remove the headstock. 8 - clean it, grease it, adjust it and all the rest. to reinstall just work backwards through the above, start by slipping the belt on the pulley, the get the back bolt in, but do not tighten until you have the two front ones in, then complete the re-assembly. 9 - I hummed and hawed about doing this, but as the others have pointed out, it makes a great difference, it is so much quieter, and easier to shift now. BY the way, mine was pretty clean inside the casting, but not one drop of grease or oil or any other kind of lube was to be found in there. (Thanks to: Robert E. Hood of Flagstaff, AZ) Here's how to remove the headstock: - Remove tailstock from ways - Remove pillow block from right end of lead screw - Remove carriage from ways - Remove gear cover and cap screw on lead screw gear - Remove gear - Remove lead screw - Remove chip guard - Turn lathe upside down (you will need a box or something about 6" high to support the ways) - Remove chip tray - Remove motor cover and motor; place motor on a support so that wires are not strained. - Remove electrical box from front of machine - Remove plastic shield behind electrical box; above lead screw - At this point you can get at the 3 6MM cap screws that attach the headstock to the ways. These are very tight and are best removed using a 6MM hex wrench in a 3/8 drive socket wrench with a 'universal joint' angle drive. A regular 6mm hex key with a long extension might work but there is risk of stripping the cap screw heads. - That's it. I did not mess with the main bearings behind the green plastic rings and don't recommend it. (Thanks to: Frank H., VA 1761) How do you remove the cross-slide? First remove the three screws that attach the splash guard to the rear of the bed. Next crank the cross slide all the way to the rear of the machine. When the slide no longer moves with the lead screw grasp it with your hand and remove from the machine. Do not let the gib strip fall and break. Note the position of the gib strip for re- installing. (Thanks to: JS. EARLY 5097) 1 remove the tail stock 2 remove the bearing that holds up the end of the lead screw 3 remove the cross slide (right off the end of the lathe.) (Thanks to: 5098) How do I replace the belt on my 7x10? 1) Remove change gear cover. 2) Remove cap head screw located upper Left corner ov Forward-Neutral-Reverse housing. 3) Remove cap head screw located to the Right of the two white idler gears. 4) Remove the Forward-Neutral-Reverse housing. 5) Remove Motor protective cover. Two cap head screws. You should now have complete access to the motor & belt drive area. You will probably have to loosen the motor mount nuts. Do not move the Allen screws/studs. just loosen the 10mm nust (the two horizontal ones 3 & 9 o'clock leave 12 & 6 o'clock alone). Slip the belt on. Pull gently down on the motor & re-tighten the two 10mm nuts loosened earlier. Reverse 1-5 above & you should be done. (Thanks to Ty Hoeffer 5711) Ty, thanks for the info. I didn't see your message until I changed the belt, and once I looked at the lathe, it was easy to see what to do. I was worried that the belt was going to be difficult to get at. The Grizzly part number is P4031-029 and cost $12.50. I bought two just in case I damage the belt again. One of them is pretty straight, but the other has a lot of curve in it--I used the straight one. On my lathe, there isn't a keeper on the motor gear and the belt tends to ride partway off the gear and occasionally slips off. I have tried adjusting the motor position and have improved it a bit, but it still isn't right, but I will keep working at it. (Thanks to: Jesse Bregman 5754) Where can I get spare parts for my 7x10? You can get parts from harbor freight, or grizzly just call them with part number, and then wait for it to arrive. It would seem HF is a lot slower at getting parts, so be prepared. (Thanks to: Robert Hood of Flagstaff, AZ 5486) How do I know what the Grizzly part number is? In a previous message, someone told me that the Grizzly parts for this lathe are just P4031 (the lathe number with a P before it) followed by the part number in the lathe parts list (the belt is part 29). (Thanks to: Jesse Bregman 5754) -- To order from Grizzly: Substitute a "P" for their letter in the model number. Add a dash and the number from manual. Example: Lathe: Model G4031 Part: 29 - Timing Belt x 70 x 95 Then order: P4031-29 (Thanks to: Lewis Balentine 5488) How do I order a second tailstock? Order part number 138 for model 33684 from HF. From the order invoice: ITEM SKU: 33684 ITEM DESC=LATHE-7"x10" MINI MODEL NO: 33684 QTY R VENDOR PART DESCRIPTION PRICE EXTENSION 1 4 138 TAILSTOCK CASTING 13.45 13.45 Harbor Freight Tools Co. 3491 Mission Oaks Blvd. Camarillo, CA. 93010 Phone: (800) 444-3353 Fax: (805) 388-8870 (Thanks to: Rick C. 1684) What is the part Grizzly part number for a belt? I just bought two from Grizzly. Their part# is P4031-029 and are $12.50 each. Mine arrived in 3 days. (Thanks to: Jesse Bregman 5835) What belt does the HF 7x10 take? The HF belt is metric. If you can find a place to order from, the specifics of this belt designation is as follows - 350 Length(70 teeth), 5M pitch, 09 width. Fortunately I live close to MOTION INDUSTRIES, INC. . They have branches located nation wide. Hope this information is helpful in your repair. (Thanks to: Dorwin C. Snyder 5844) -- Be sure you check what kind of belt you have. I ordered a Grizzly belt for mine and wound up having to order new gears. The Grizzly belt is an XL series belt and the one on my lathe was a metric series. The tech people can probably tell you by the color of the gears. (Metric - black and XL- white (Thanks to: Gary Hallenbeck ) -- MODIFICATIONS TO THE 7X10 What modifications can/should I make to the 7x10? There are many modifications out there. See the personal web sites for a more complete listing. How to you eliminate backlash from the cross-feed? The newly arrived April/May 2000 issue of Machinist's Workshop has an interesting article on constricting a replacement cross-feed nut to eliminate backlash in a Grizzly lathe. Machinist's Workshop is a sister magazine to Home Shop Machinist and Live Steam published by Village Press, http://www.villagepress.com/pub.htm. The cross-feed thread nut in the article has a 0.625-10 LH Acme thread which is larger than the 10-1.0 LH (metric) in our 7X10 minilathe can likely be adapted. The article in Machinist's Workshop is clearly copyrighted so it is probably not a good idea to reproduce it or to post it. For those not having access to the article I will try to give a general description of the principle that is used to eliminate the backlash or slop. A portion of the cross-feed nut, which is made from a brass alloy, is sliced axially after it is threaded. The cross feed nut is now in two pieces similar to the half- nuts on the carriage, which engages the feed screw for threading. The two parts of the cross-feed nut can now be displaced axially in respect to each other to eliminate the backlash. Once adjusted for no backlash, four screws that hold the two sections together are tightened. The actual adjustment is by means of two setscrews placed in a lip that had been left on the end of one of the two pieces. Thin plastic spacers are placed between the two parts of the nut to allow them to more easily slide. An additional feature built into the new cross-feed nut is a base mounted on the cross-slide, which engages a dovetail in the cross-feed nut. This tends to compensate for any lateral strain imposed by a twisted cross-feed screw. If one of us adapts the cross-feed nut to the 7X10 minilathe, the design can then be posted. (Thanks to: Norman Plaks 5780) What switch can I replace the power switch with? What switch can I replace the reverse switch with? I just received a new cat from Surplus Center #273. There is a switch on page 142 that might be of interest to some on the group. Item H 11-1835. Brand new Arrow Hart 4PDT with center off position. Interlock prevents shifting from on to on without pausing in the off position.Contacts are rated at 10 amps 125 volts AC. It says it fits 3/4" panel opening. It maybe too big for our little lathe, but if it would fit it sure would make a nice fix for a problem that many were having. Cost is $9.95. (Thanks to: Jim Hardin) Where can I get a replacement potentiometer for my speed control? I replaced mine 3 month's ago, I had the same problem. Cat. No. 271-1715 was the Radio Shack part number. I think it was 2 or 3 bucks. hope this helps. (Thanks to: Wesley Pilley 5057) How do I add bearings to crossslide? As promised, I've (hastily) put up a web page detailing the modifications I made to add a bearing to the compound on my minilathe. It's online at http://aardvark.co.nz/pjet/lathefix.htm (Thanks to: Bruce Simpson 5148) I've uploaded into the VAULT a drawing (CmpndBearing.DXF) of the compound slide leadscrew with an assembly including my version of the bearing modification. I did the drawing first as a way to get dimensions of the bearing housing and in the process discovered that I need to make an additional sleeve to act as a spacer between the leadscrew shoulder and the graduated dial. Don't know why my situation would be so different than Bruce's (http://aardvark.co.nz/pjet/lathefix.htm) but it seems to be. Making it went really great. Got the fit really good and the dimensions in the drawing worked out perfectly. But when it was assembled, it wobbles. I leave this morning for a week in Mexico (darn ;-) so I can't get into figuring out exactly why. At first I thought it was because the leadscrew is bent/crooked. There is at least 5 thou runout in it. There were a couple re-chucks involved during turning, one due to not disengaging the feed during boring and one due to stalling the motor on cutoff, so I suspect its from these. But the wobble seems to be in the bearing housing ID where the bearing seats as well as in the OD and back surface, so it may be a combination of all. I'll remake the bearing housing when I get back. I'm also planning on making a new leadscrew someday, but I need to get some practice threads under my belt first. Been a long time since I've done any thread turning on a lathe. Any comments or suggestions appreciated, especially on how to do it without the sleeve. (Thanks to: Rick K. of Portland, OR 5650) How do I reduce the speed on my 7x10? After reading Jose's instructions on how to slow the lathe speed electronically I thought I would give it a try. Jose's instructions were for the single speed model. My lathe is the two speed model currently available. My lathe is band new, never having a cut made on it. I will try to be as detailed as possible so please bear with me. DETERMINING A STANDARD: I decided I needed a standard to judge my success against so the first order of business was to measure the lathe's spindle speed prior to making any adjustments. I used an old Starrett Mechanical Speed Indicator (the type with the worm gear and engraved dial) to measure the speed. I decided to take my initial reading in HIGH gear (H on the back lever). My speed was 460 rpm prior to adjustment. PLEASE NOTE THAT I SET THE SPEED CONTROL ON THE FRONT PANEL TO THE LOWEST POSSIBLE SETTING FOR ALL MEASUREMENTS AND ADJUSTMENTS. I got in a hurry and did not measure the LOW gear speed (L on the back lever) but based on later observations and the ratio between HIGH and LOW, I would estimate the LOW gear speed to be approximately 230 rpm prior to adjustment. OPENING IT UP: The next step involved was opening the control panel up. It actually consists of removing the control box from the gearhead box by removing four large phillips head machine screws, one at each corner. The controls are mounted inside the box that comes off...not on the gearhead. Next I turned the box over to see what was inside. I immediately saw that everything was protected by a thin plastic sheet secured by four screws. I only removed the two screws on the potentiometer (POT) end of the box...which is the bottom if you are looking into the box while having the control panel switch assembly on top. I folded the plastic back and stuck an end under the wiring to hold it out of the way. The box was now ready for ADJUSTMENTS! PLEASE NOTE THAT ALL FUTURE REFERENCES TO THE POSITION OF ITEMS INSIDE THE BOX WILL ASSUME YOU ARE HOLDING THE BOX AS OUTLINED ABOVE. IT'S DIFFERENT: The first thing I noticed was that this control was slightly different from the single speed unit Jose described. At the BOTTOM of the box were THREE POTS INSTEAD OF FOUR. My first instinct was to panic and close it back up but reason finally won out and I decided to proceed. I was fortunate in that my machine came with a very simple schematic of the inside of the box showing the three POTS with one of them labeled SPEED. I decided this had to be the one to turn. I looked inside the box and saw the three POTS located at the bottom of the box (as I held it vertical in front of me as outlined above). The POT on the LEFT corresponded to the one in the schematic labeled SPEED. To further convince me this was the correct one, this POT is located with the adjustment slot directly facing you when holding it as described. When held this way, the other two (middle and right) have their adjustment slots facing straight up. Another give away is that the POT on the left is BLUE an the other two are black. The adjustment slot is yellow on all three. I decided to take Jose's advice and mark the original position of the adjustment slot with a pen prior to adjustment. ADJUSTMENT: I decided to turn the machine on and adjust the POT while the motor was running. ALL ADJUSTMENTS were made with the lathe in HIGH gear with the speed control set to the lowest RPM in the FORWARD position. I first turned the adjuster counter clockwise and to my delight, the spindle speeded up! I next turned it CLOCKWISE and it slowed down. I turned it until the chuck stalled as Jose mentioned. I next turned it more CLOCKWISE to see if it started again but it did not on this model. I then went the other way to what seemed like a good speed. I measured this speed with the Starrett indicator and found that the lowest possible speed in HIGH gear had reduced from a pre-adjustment 460 rpm to a new reading of 110 rpm! ONLY A FOURTH OF WHAT I STARTED WITH! I next shifted the rear lever to LOW and checked the rpm which now indicated 50 rpm! TORQUE: I decided to load the chuck with my hand as Jose did in his video to get a rough measurement of torque. At 110 rpm in HIGH gear it was difficult to apply enough pressure to stall the chuck...but it WAS possible with sufficient hand pressure. At the 50 rpm LOW gear setting, I could not stall the chuck although I could slow it down some. One thing I noticed in both attempts at applying a load was that the spindle/chuck assembly tended to chatter and rotate with surging motion under the highest pressure from my hand. I decided to raise the lowest possible rpm settings a little by turning the POT COUNTER-CLOCKWISE. Doing so stopped the chatter and speed surging. FINAL SETTING: I finally settled on a speed of 140 rpm in HIGH gear and 70 rpm in LOW gear. These two speeds seemed to give good torque without chatter. I next turned the control panel speed control to the fastest speed to see if it still worked...it did! It should be remembered that while it might be possible to stall the machine by applying pressure to the 3" chuck, it would prove much more difficult to stall it when feeding a tool into a small diameter workpiece. CLOSING IT UP: The final step was to replace the thin plastic cover over the electrical components and mount the control box back on the lathe. This was actually tougher than reducing the speed! The bottom left screw is in a tight spot and my eyes aren't what they use to be! Finally I wised up and tilted the whole lathe over on its back and dropped the screw right in. Everything went back very nicely. DISCLAIMER: Unfortunately in this legalistic age, I feel that it is necessary to state the following: The above is only a detailed description of what I did to MY LATHE. I am not suggesting that anyone do this to theirs. I would imagine that such modification voids any warranty that might be in effect. I am not an electrician and cannot guarantee that the modification made will allow the lathe to operate properly in the future. It may melt the motor the first time it is used! Anyone trying such a modification should realize that all mini-lathes may not be made the same inside and the position and function of the components in mine may differ for others. Anyone attempting such a modification should take great care when working around the electrical components to avoid electrical shock. I assume no responsibility for any harm you or your lathe may suffer should you attempt the same adjustments I did. You are on your own! Good luck! (Thanks to: Gerald Johnson 0044) Can I buy a 7x12 bed to increase the length of my 7x10? Yes, or for $50usd more you can buy another 7x10 (don't forget to get a longer leadscrew). Leadscrew stop switch Are there any modifications to add limit switches? I have posted to the vault 4 pictures taken of a modification to the 7x10 for winding choke coils. We were requested by one of our customers to manufacture a new type CB radio antenna for motor cycles and one of the parts is a loading choke coil. We investigated several machines from 3 to 6 thousand dollars and none of them would give exactly 26 turns in two inches. I took my #2 7x10 and fitted a 3MT 180DA chuck and drawbar to it. I modified the live center to female to hold the other end of the coil form. Then I set the gear train for 13 tpi threading. It worked good but was hard to stop at the right point. I then fitted two microswitches to stop the motor at the right point at each end of the travel. It now stops within a 1/4 turn every time at both ends of the stroke. The next project on this machine is to make a lever operated closer for the collet as the nut closer is very slow. After that it will be a lever operation for the tailstock center to speed that up. I might have to several of these setups as the potential production is 5 to 6 thousand a week. With all the discussion lately of travel limit switches I thought some might be interested. (Thanks to: James W. Early 5453) How do I add grease holes? I have two 7x10 and have make holes and tap them in order to be able to lubricate the gears and put a 3/8" x 1/2" hex bolt, BEFORE YOU DRILL BE VERY CAREFULLY BECAUSE THER IS VERY LITTLE SPACE BETWEEN THE WALL AND THE GEARS, I USED A 6" METAL RULE AS A PROTECTOR WHILE DRILLING, GOOD LUCK , as a lubricator I use a enema type of syringe filled with moly grease. The approx. measurements are from the front (chuck side) 1.375" and 2.875" and the distance from the top is 1.875" the holes are to be made on the Hi-Lo lever side. Double check the measurements and BE VERY CAREFUL. Good luck. (Thanks to: Ricardo Van Oordt 1805,1809) Why would I need to increase the internal hole diameter of the spindle? Reaming the headstock allows you to put larger diameter material completely through the headstock. The standard chuck can still be used to hold the material. How do I increase the internal hole diameter of the spindle? Remove the chuck from the headstock. Install a 1/2" drill chuck in the tailstock {on a #2MT arbor}. Insert a 13/16" reamer into the spindle hole until it stops against the rear portion of the morse taper. Slide the tailstock towards the headstock and then tighten the drill chuck onto the shank of the reamer. This insures that the reamer is concentric as possible. Turn on the lathe (slow) and use the tailstock crank to advance the reamer thru the spindle until the tailstock reaches maximum extension. Back the reamer out and slide the tailstock further toward the headstock and repeat the procedure until you emerge from the back of the spindle. Be sure to use some method of keeping swarf from falling out of the rear of the spindle and into the change gears. Cardboard tubes and film canisters have been suggested. (Thanks to: Don Murry of Ohio) Where do I get a 13/16" reamer? Currently, posting a message on the 7x10 egroup will get you on the list to receive the Varmint Al Honorary 13/16" Reamer. You pay for shipping to the next reamer user. Varmint Al's complete message: You can bore out the spindle in place. I did mine by using a 13/16 Chucking Reamer I got from KBC (5-015- 225). It cost about $15 and has a long shank. The problem was that the shank is about 5/8" and would not fit in my 1/2 tailstock chuck. I used my 4-Jaw chuck (that would pass the reamer head) and supported the end of the reamer's shank on the live center. I turned down a 1" length of the shank to 1/2" so it would fit in the chuck. One word of caution. When you do ream out the headstock, take the gear cover off and make sure the gear train is off and the gears are covered with a protective cloth or you will fill the gears with cast iron chips. Here is an offer... Email me your address and I will mail the reamer that I used to you. Then when you are finished with it, you can send it on to the next person who wants to ream out their headstock. It can make the rounds.... (BIG Thanks to: Varmint Al) How do I get more length out of my 7x10? Over the Labor day weekend I modified my 7x10 in the area of extending the leadscrew and moving its r-h bracket further to the right. I had not seen anyone do this before, and it looked to be an almost obvious improvement. I fabricated a simple ell shape from some 1/4" channel stock and bolted it to the end of the base, and bolted the r-h bushing/bracket to that. To lengthen the leadscrew, I turned a piece of round stock to a matching diameter and cut, and inserted it into the area that is just to the right of the left-hand bushing journal. I carefully tig welded it in place and straightened it once both ends of the insert were welded. The insert extends a little out from behind the control box and in effect moved the majority of the screw to the right. The move amounts to about 4.5" so I am now able to move the carriage clear off to the right end of the ways. This gives a lot more room to maneuver. It is real nice to be able to (with the tailstock off) move that carriage way out of the way. How do I add wipers to the carriage? Then I made up a nice felt wiper system for the ways that mounts to the two little threaded holes on the left side of the carriage. This keeps most of the shavings out from under the carriage and keeps a layer of jim How do I add a Tailstock adjuster? How do I replace the handles on the 7x10? How might I make the compound rotation easier to rotate? Along with the other mods to the 7X10. I have been wondering if there was a way to make the compound rotation more "user friendly". I was thinking that two holes might be drilled perpendicular to the screws in the back and front of the compound base. Then some small set screws inserted along with cutting teeth in the heads of the compounds original screws. The new screws would work like worm drives to tighten or loosen the compound. The new screws would have to be held in place somehow. Maybe a small disk cut like a washer with OD force fit over the heads of the new screws. This would all have to be on the small side as I only see about a 1/4 inch (6mm) of space for the counter bore in the bottom slide. Has anyone got another more practical idea ??? (Thanks to: Lewis Balentine) How do I prevent chips from entering the hand wheel gearing? Varmit Al's web site shows a modification for a chip guard. How do I lock the carriage when performing facing cuts? Varmit Al's web site shows a simple carriage lock. How do I keep chips out of my 7x10's gears? Add an easy to remove plug in the end of the spindle. How do I upgrade or replace the motor on my 7x10? The RPMs are 5000. The HP is about 1/3rd, despite the "3/4" value cited. If you want to talk "peak" HP, it might be 1/2. I have one of the treadmill motors Jose uses, and someone else mentioned recently. It's a great buy. It's also GREATLY more powerful than the stock motor. Only problem is, I like the compactness of having the motor attached to the under/back side of the lathe. Were it me and I was in your situation, I would buy the motor that Grizzly uses on their mini mill. It's slightly larger than the 7x10's motor, but is roughly the same thing. The controller is FAR better IMHO. The HP is also a little higher. I'm not sure what the RPMs are, but since the head on the mini mill appears to be the exact same casting as the 7x10, I'd think the RPMs would be a perfect fit. The nice thing about Grizzly's motor is the speed is from 0 to whatever, instead of 200 to whatever. So you won't have to do anything to slow it down. I think someone said the motor AND controller for Grizzly's 7x10/7x12 was a little over $50. I'm hoping to find out that the mill's motor is likewise inexpensive. One problem: You'll have to duplicate the tap in the housing (gulp). (Thanks to: Mike W. 5602) Anybody got any good ideas for a collet chuck / closer for the 7x10? Check the vault at eGroups or at Ty Hoeffer's site for the files ER32CHUCK.DWG (if you have AutoCad R14) or ER32CHUCK.JPG. This is a simple chuck that requires machining of only one piece (chuck body); it's just over 2 inches long, uses ER32 collets (clamps up to 0.787 diameter) and bolts directly to the spindle flange. In addition to purchasing the ER collets, one would also need to purchase a collet nut and spanner wrench. For those that need to clamp something larger than 0.787 in (20mm), the chuck can be scaled up to use ER40 collets (1.18 in max capacity). If anyone is interested, drop me a note and I can modify the design. An alternative is to buy a collet chuck which has a 3MT shank. J&L carries these in ER, single angle and double angle styles. Much easier than making one, but not nearly as much fun. (Thanks to: Mike of Carrollton, TX 5563) LINKS 7x10 sites Busy Bee Tools (Canada) http://www.busybeetools.com/ http://www.busybeetools.com/itm00227.htm Grizzly (home page, 7x12 order page) http://www.grizzlyindustrial.com/ http://www.grizzlyindustrial.com/fcgi-bin/lookup.fcgi/products/lookup.cfg?q=item&kw=G8688 Grizzly Outlet (home page, 7x10 order page) http://www.grizzlyoutlet.com/index2.html http://www.grizzlyoutlet.com/fcgi-bin/lookup.fcgi/lookup.cfg?q=sub_category&kw=Metal%20Lathes Harbor Freight (home page, 7x10 order page) http://www.harborfreight.com/index.html http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=33684 Runmaster (7x10 - Taiwan/China manufacturer) http://www.runmaster.com.tw/index.html Northern Tool & Equipment Co. (7x12 not online. Catalog number143357-C146 $499.99usd) http://www.northerntool.com/ http://www.lathes.co.uk/ Accessory sites Enco (The New) http://www.use-enco.com/ Grainger http://www.grainger.com/index.htm J&L Industrial: http://www.jlindustrial.com/ http://www.jandlindustrial.com/ KBC Tools & Machinery http://kbctools.com/ McMaster-Carr http://www.mcmaster.com/ MSC http://www.mscdirect.com/ Wholesale Tools http://www.wttool.com Lindsay Books http://www.lindsaybks.com Personal Sites The Harbor Freight 7" x 10" Mini Metalworking Lathe page (Owner's manual-jpg, adjustments, metal pen project, mill attachment) http://www.cyberramp.net/~mike/ml/minilathe.htm Jose 7x10 (Videos, articles, photos) http://www.homestead.com/tool20895/jose7x10taig.html Ty's HF 7x10 Mini Lathe Page (specifications, manual-pdf, links, photos-great closeups, projects) http://warhammer.mcc.virginia.edu/ty/7x10/index.html Varmit Al's Mini Lathe Page (photos, links, bit grinding, feed gear tables, adjustments/mods) http://www.cctrap.com/~varmint/alath.htm Metalworking Sites TABLETOP MACHINING http://www.sherline.com/bookplug.htm SHERLINE Lathe Operating Instructions http://www.sherline.com/latheins.htm SHERLINE Lathe and Mill Setup Instructions (Aligning the head and tailstock Use of cutting oils and lubricants General machining terms General rules for feed rates and cutting speeds) http://www.sherline.com/setupins.htm Metal Web News http://www.loganact.com/mwn/mr.html Department of the Army, FUNDAMENTALS OF MACHINE TOOLS http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/tc/9-524/toc.htm Non-7x10 (taig, bandsaw...) 4x6 Horizontal/Vertical Bandsaw FAQ http://www.halcyon.com/meretrix/4x6bsFAQ.html Clisby (micro lathe) http://www.clisby.com.au/ Nick Carter's Taig page http://www.pioneer.net/~felice/taig.html Shirline Products Home page http://www.sherline.com/ Taig Tools International http://www.taigtools.com/ Project links John's Steam & Stuff http://www.intergate.com/~john/page11.html HOW TO BUILD MINIATURE ENGINES http://www.prismz.com/minipower/ The Model Engineer Support Page http://www.btinternet.com/~chrisheapy/homepage.htm The Berndt Turbine Project http://handy.gvi.net/~rberndt/ Gas Turbine Project Pages http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/gas/turbine.htm WOODTURNING (OR HOW TO SUCKER MORE PEOPLE INTO THE CLUB?) How do I make wood pens with the 7x10? Mak'n Pens APPENDIX A - GENERAL FORUM QUESTIONS Where can I find the 7x10 FAQ? http://www.egroups.com/docvault/7x10minilathe/FAQ Where can I find the mini-mill FAQ? Write it yourself. How do I search the rec.crafts.metalworking archives? www.deja.com How do I view the archives to this group? A far more effective method is to download the historical database/help file and do your searching offline. Go to the "Vault" (blue & white Toolbar) and download two files: E7X10Group.chm hhupd.exe To run it, double click on the .chm file. Use the Search function in this help file, locate messages of interest and do what searching you can here. Then if you want to view the message threads, note their message number and go back to the online database (this site) and do some navigating & reading. (Thanks to: Rick Kruger 4594) What is LOL? Laughing Out Loud(most probably), Laugh Out Loud(also valid). Lookie Oh Lema(not likely) What is ROTFL? Rolling On The Floor, Laughing. What is BTW? By The Way What is SWMBO? She Who Must Be Obeyed What is HF? Harbor Freight What is Grizzly? Grizzly Industrial is a national mailorder company in the U.S.A. providing high quality woodworking and metalworking machinery and accessories. What newsgroups are 7x10 related? rec.crafts.metalworking What is a newbie? You. I was wondering if HF or Grizzly would give list members a discount or a group purchase discount? No, but you can ask. What is usd (or USD)? United States Dollars. As opposed to Canadian dollars,.. What is OEM? Original Equipment Manufacture. APPENDIX B - GENERAL MACHINING QUESTIONS What is Cosmoline? A sticky, greasy, rust preventative coating found on machinery. Referred to, in one post, as "egg foo goo". What is JT? Jacobs Taper. What is MT? Morse Taper. What metals will hss tool bits successfully cut? What metals must you use carbide tool bits on.? HSS can be used to cut most metals except for hardened steel--for that you definitely need carbide. Stainless can be cut with HSS, but it's a real pain and requires frequent resharpening/honing of the tool bit. Carbide's main advantage is that it holds an edge much longer than HSS, but HSS gives better finishes. I use carbide (indexable inserts) most of the time regardless of what I am turning (aluminum, brass, steel, stainless) mainly because I'm lazy. I'll use HSS when I need a nicer finish on a piece than carbide can provide. Be careful of the grade of carbide that you choose. The "quality import" brazed carbide tools are a mixed bag. I have had more bad luck than good with them, but there are others in this group who have had no problem with them. If you are planning to do much work with stainless or really tenacious materials, get good carbide tools. If most of what you work with is softer materials like aluminum or brass, HSS will be fine. Just keep your tool bits sharp. (Thanks to: Mike of Carrollton, TX 5160) What publications (magazines) are available for metal heads? The Home Shop Machinist Projects In Metal (back issues only) Machinist's Workshop (formerly Projects in Metal) Live Steam How do I sharpen bits? How do I grind bits? To grind Tungsten Carbide tool bits, you will need a Green Silicon Carbide grinding wheel. They are actually "softer" (wear away faster) than the Gray Aluminum Oxide grinding wheels used for HSS tool bits. I have a 6"x1/2" wide medium grit Gray Aluminum Oxide wheel on one side and a 6"x1/2" wide fine Green Silicon Carbide wheel on the other side of my grinder. I grind my HSS tool bits on the medium grit wheel. I have a cup of cold water for keeping the tool bits cool. After I finish grinding the desired shape, I make a final smoothing cut on the Silicon Carbide wheel which leaves a very fine finish. Then I hone the tool bit to get it really sharp. The Aluminum Oxide wheel will not readily grind the carbide tool bits and merely heats them up and dulls the grinding wheel in the process. The Silicon Carbide wheel grinds the Tungsten Carbide tool bits well, but the wheel wears away much faster than an Aluminum Oxide wheel. After grinding for 10 to 15 seconds plunge the tool bit in the cold water to keep it cool. It becomes like an art to continue grinding at the same place and angle between trips to the cup of cold water. I would suggest getting a single point diamond wheel dresser. The one I have is a 1/3 carat diamond on a 3/8" shaft and only costs about $6.00. Also when you mount the grinding wheel, and tighten the nut, rotate it by hand and see if the face runs true. If it doesn't, fuss with it a bit and try different positions till the run-out is the best you can get. This simple step helped quite a bit in reducing grinder vibrations. Then true the face with the diamond wheel dresser. (Thanks to: Varmint Al 5285) QUOTE OF THE DAY: QUALITY! Products featured by Harbor Freight have passed rigorous inspection by our quality assurance team. Our 100% satisfaction guarantee is our solid commitment to you that if for any reason you are not satisfied with any item, simply return it for a fast, courteous, hassle free refund!